تم وضع المناقشة في منتدى ألمانيا
Many of my foreign friends who live in Germany complain that Germans are very rude - or at least unfriendly.
Obviously, as a German myself I don't really experience us that way. But I would like your opinion: Are we really as cold as some people say????
Thanks Laurie
تم إرسال المناقشة من قبل N W في منتدى ألمانيا
Thanks Laurie,
you definitely made a point here. I love the last paragraph of your blog. There are always pros and cons in every society. You are all right, the Germans are probably the worst service culture ever and I must confess, I looked at others quite seriously as well but this was probably because I lost my glasses. Actually in every culture some people are short-sighted, and often more mentally and physically.So I appreciate that you all studied some German history and I must admit that I myself learned more about my culture and habits by studying American history than the German one. Yeah and G.M., Laurie's advice is in my opinion quite a good one, try to make it the "German" way! Stick to your friends and family. Perhaps some of them have an idea.
I mean they have to, at least, give you some advice which might help a bit. I wish you good luck once more. And no, you're criticism is not anti-German, it is actually typically German because we tend to complain the whole time and most of all about our society and culture. I guess that is the bad side of the coin when being that cautious.
"Do something. If it works, do more of it. If it doesn't, do something else. " F.D.R.
Adjusting without hard feelings
تم إرسال المناقشة من قبل Laurie Perkins في منتدى ألمانيا
G.M.
Don't know how long you have been living in Germany or what the family situation is there. Your wife's family should be supportive of their son-n-law. If they are not, it is not because they are German, it is because they aren't "nice". In general "Germans" are cautious people as you well know. Like I stated above in my last comment, there are good and bad people all over the world. Try not to sweat the small stuff and look for support from your inner circle which would be your wife's family and friends. Family and friends are of utmost importance to "most" Germans.They should be enough of a buffer until you become more accustom. And do your very best to not "internalize" the events around you. No matter where we live we are lucky to find "one really good friend" and super lucky to have two. Perhaps you would feel comfortable seeking out other Americans who have moved to Germany and experiencing difficulties adapting. Sometimes two heads are better than one.
On a positive note, it was a very loving gesture on your part to leave "your" country to live in your wife's country. Also, very proactive to study German history. Just continue to be nice guy and regardless of where you are from or where you go "any country" people won't be able to deny it! Good luck with your in laws.
pah
تم إرسال المناقشة من قبل Joe Bob في منتدى ألمانيا
Laurie is intelligent you are not. How do you look?
Are Germans Rude
تم إرسال المناقشة من قبل Laurie Perkins في منتدى ألمانيا
Wow!!!! I am American. Hats off to the Gentleman that wrote the long history lesson. I am certain cultural history has a big part in forming "norms" in societies. I have had the pleasure and the honor of visiting Germany on two different occasions. Like with most things, I could list the pros and cons. However, because I am am American, we have the tendency to be a "Polite" society. (Not everyone, but in general) Perhaps, I should say, our society would rather all of us be polite and not speak our minds but nod and smile. We normally smile at everyone we pass by. It is just what you do.
When I was in Germany (not in Berlin) I noticed quickly the serious looks on "most" people's faces. I was shoved in the store a couple times because I was carelessly blocking the isles, haha! Yes, this was rude and I would have been more than happy to move if someone said "excuse me". However, I took it in good humor for the most part. I did amuse myself one morning walking through the city. I tried to make eye contact with everyone I passed (very difficult task) and then smile and see if they would smile back. Unfortunately, most did not.
In defense of the Germany Cultural. I will say this, I have friends in Germany and they would do anything in the world for me. I know their love is genuine. I had the pleasure of observing their little family and I was so jealous of how close they were. Americans could take a lesson or two from their family values.
Let's face it. There are jerks all over the world and just because you are German or American, Italian or whatever does not make you immune. It is better to simply understand the culture so you aren't offended or take something personal that has really nothing to do with you. I love Germans. I have a lot respect for them, but I have also had to hear more than once that "Americans" are superficial. I hate that. I never defend myself, I simply let them get to know me, and let them decide for themselves. I think it is safe to say, that I have one over a few Germans :-)
I think we should simply love each other for who we are and spend less time pointing out the bad but looking for the good and then trying to understand what feels uncomfortable to us. Having a mutual respect for each other is what is most important. America is big for tolerance, but please remember all those from another country, everything comes at a price. Peace!!!
Please stop it!
تم إرسال المناقشة من قبل N W في منتدى ألمانيا
@ TY, J.L., G.M.
After reading in this forum for quite some time, I must interrupt and say this is getting quite personal and inapropriate and don't blame me it was really interesting. But I must apologize for the rude manners of some of my fellow citizens. I think best would be to give you a little history lesson about how the German culture or manners "evoked".
The rudeness against others derives from a low self-confidence
This self-confidence does not only come from the 2 lost world wars, but also from the feeling that we were the last nation to be created in Europe not accepted by everyone as being too big (i.e. with too many people living in one nation at the time). Instead of accepting us as a nation, Britain, France, Russia to name just a few, saw us as an enourmous threat in 1871. So power had to be consolidated. After 1871 when we Germans at least got one nation, we were dreaming of becoming a global player, always taking Britain as our idol, like the little child that wants to be like his father without thinking that we might be that much of a threat. Funnily at that time the Turkish or so called Ottoman culture was seen as exotic and interesting and some parts of the Turkish culture was quickly adapted, because the Ottoman Empire was one of our few allies.
Before that Germany never existed, the HRRDN was not a true state, it was a bit like the EU with a stronger executive but no legesilature at that time. You had to cross at least 20 broders in order to get from Hamburg to Munich. This might be a reason why in order to create a German state, nationalism was valued very highly at that time period during 1804 (Reichsdeputationshauptschluss and the foundation of Germany) 1871. After Napoleon crushed the HRRDN. The era that followed the so called Era Metternich, was one of extreme censorship and oppression of any liberal and nationalistic thinking in order to garanty the 2 dominant German states at that time Austria and Prussia, states that did not have any modern legitimacy (Austria-Hungary begin a semi-multi-cultural state through oppression of other cultures and Prussia having evoked of the relicts of the Teutonic Order which was there to fight pagans and afterwards the poles, I think the battle of Grunewald is quite famous for that), but above all the feudal system. Thus, Germans started to have 2 tendencies a nationalistic which actually led to the 1848 revolution and which was later misused by the Nazi Regime. This movement had open-minded and extremly high-educated followers (Robert Blum might be one famous person I would rather name Friedrich Heckers or Gustav Struve or the Grimm Brothers). On the other hand, the Biedermeier culture was predominant which means staying at home, not doing anything, accepting the current situation and looking for the right friends that might not blame you to the authorities.And that is in my opinion why it stayed this way. We, Germans, are very petit- bourgeois scared of any false movement in public so we rather hide a smile because a smile can also be misinterpreted and wait for the other side to do something. This might not be very polite but it was healthy though. Good close friend was always more important for Germans than the first public opinion, since you can't move away which is quite different to the American culture with its moving frontier and manifest destiny. And by not smiling and being that overwhelmingly friendly you can value friendly behaviour and mimics higher. You can move saver and it is easier to make close friends. That is why we care for others differently, we want our privacy because we don't want problems. I don't like it either but that is the way it is. We would never accept wide open land with no fences between houses like in RI or Kentucky.
In addition the Biedermeier time and the quite high population density even during medieval times let to another quite strong German character trait. Ones ground and home are valued very highly. I don't mean your village or city, I mean the place you are living in. And as it is seen as the most highest good of your privacy, Germans usually don't like showing it. Therefore high fences and trees. But on the other hand public encounters during festivals and feasts are very important and appreciated. Might be strange at first but that is the way it is.
The extreme sometimes brutal disrespect against foreigners is sad and intolerable but it is typical for unicultural nations you can actually see that in every country in Nothern Europe even in the liberal Netherlands. When you are used to one kind of behaviour why changing it. Funnily we have a derogatory saying for that in Germany: "Was der Bauer nicht kennt, das mag er nicht." What the farmer (used as the stupid guy from the countryside) doesn't know, he doesn't like."
This first form of disrespect doesn't exist in the American nations because they are founded on values ideas and one of the most important of these ideas in the USA for example is "e pluribus unum". That is why so many people came to America because they didn't have that kind of a society there. Neithertheless racial discrimmination has always existed and it will exist also in the US. You are only one step ahead because you had to cope with that problem a bit earlier have you forgotten those awesome persons that fought heavily against it like Rosa Parks, Martin Luther King, Malcom X or Jesse Jacksons in the 60s and 70s in America fighting against the Jim Crow laws and others. Do parallel societies still exist in America? Yes (Chinatown, Little Italy) Are they bad? Integration is sometimes quite frustrating so why not sticking to the ones of your own kind. Furthermore I love eating Turkish and Asian food (not only Döner but also Sushi etc. ist the most consumed meal in Germany). We have to fight against disrespect but it exists all over the world. Do we hate to watch the German football team because it mainly exists out of "Ausländers like Özil(Turkish descent) Podolski (Polish descent) and others" no.G.M. I hope you will find a nice job in Germany
J.L.
I know what you are thinking but look at it as a global problem we are sometimes a bunch of aholes but so are sometimes a few ignorant Americans or British people, that don't understand the we feel heavily attacked when someones is calling us Krauts or Nazis.
I hope you might now find some key to solve the problems with us cold-hearted Germans.
Accept the neighbour as being typically German, but talk to Germans in busses, in trains best in English and you will see that they will help you, when you see that someone is nice start a conversation, start explaining your situation when you see you can rely on the person and it won't let you fall. It is a bit part of our self-understanding.And please stop generalizing (like the regular German or the Germans, or some Germans), it only causes frustration and we don't want that
By the way, if anyone wants to have a bit of a clue of the negative sides of the German culture you should read the "Untertan" by Heinrich Mann.
What the hell is going on here!?
تم إرسال المناقشة من قبل تم حذف المستخدم في منتدى ألمانيا
Reading above comments I think this forum got bit out of hand...
Videos por los autores del EL PRERCIO POR ENAMORARSE DE UN PRINCIPE AZUL DEL PRIMER MUNDO
تم إرسال المناقشة من قبل تم حذف المستخدم في منتدى ألمانيا
youtube.com/watch?v=3eLoiwOU3Cw&feature=related
.
تم إرسال المناقشة من قبل Joe Bob في منتدى ألمانيا
I am not the average German but I am German! Who knows what is average? You all have lived in some cities snd tslk sbout average..... The magazin "Spiegel" write something about average after they asked 1000 Germans^^ :D
I don´t watch TV often and I am thinking: "Without foreigners my life would be more boring!"
By the way: I don´t want to live in Berlin =)
Berlin
تم إرسال المناقشة من قبل T Y في منتدى ألمانيا
I lived in a couple of German cities, Berlin was one of them. To me personally, Berlin is definitely an exception. In fact, Berlin is the only Germany city I would consider living in. It's a great city and the people are tolerant enough. And remember that as an Asian, you get a slightly better treatment than other visible minorities, say, middle easterners or south east Asians for example.
If Berlin was a representation of Germany as a whole, I would agree with you.